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In episode 20 of “The JoyPowered™ Workspace Podcast,” JoDee and Susan discuss their experiences as women in male-dominated fields and talk to Saundra Schrock, who also formerly worked in a male-dominated field, started her own company, and is researching gender-based stereotypes. Topics include what’s different for women in the workplace, “opting out” vs. “leaning in,” and the real reason we don’t see many women on boards. They also discuss Saundra’s passion project, turning everyday tasks into mindfulness activities.

Some of the issues, challenges, and opportunities women face in the workplace are the same as those that men face, but others are unique and worth talking through. JoDee and Susan discuss their experiences in male-dominated fields – JoDee’s in public accounting and Susan’s in a Fortune 50 publicly traded company. JoDee was able to work with a female partner in the accounting firm who made a positive impact as a mentor and role model, but Susan was always conscious of her gender and careful about the amount of emotion and compassion she showed in the workplace. They also discuss women feeling less confident than men about expressing their views and ethical concerns, and negotiating salary.

Susan and JoDee talk to Saundra Schrock, a former executive in the banking world who founded her own company, is a board member of another company, and is pursuing a Ph.D. in psychology with a dissertation on gender-based stereotypes. Saundra discusses some of the research she’s seen showing that women experience far more stress in the workplace than men do, are subject to a different set of rules in the workplace than men, and are expected to work harder than others to move up in the organization. She explains the implicit biases women face, where even though performance ratings for men and women are about the same, women are judged less viable for top positions than men are. People are often not even aware that they’re applying different sets of rules for men and women moving up in the organization, but it happens.

The hosts also discuss women “opting out” as they reach higher levels in the organization and women not being chosen to serve on boards, and talk to Saundra about her passion project, making ordinary everyday activities into mindfulness practice. Saundra shares her advice for business wanting to close the gender gap and women who are starting their careers.

In this episode’s listener mail, Steve, a new employee at a small company entering its busy season, was told by the owner that they’d be working 50-hour weeks for the next month with no exceptions, would be paid straight time for all 50 hours, then would make up for it by working 30 hour weeks in June and July and being paid for 40 hours. JoDee and Susan discuss the hiring process getting longer in 2017.

Mentioned in This Episode:

• Purple Ink, the HR consulting firm JoDee owns
• Susan Tinder White Consulting, the HR consulting firm Susan owns
• JoyPowered, JoDee’s book
• Women in Business, an organization Susan was president of in college
• “Why Women Disengage at Work”, an article explaining a Mercer survey saying women don’t feel able to express their views or ideas or report ethical concerns at work
• Levelhead, guest Saundra’s company that created a mobile learning app focused on improving business performance and functional mindfulness
• Elevate, where Saundra is a board member
• Lean In, Facebook COO Sheryl Sandberg’s book about women in the workplace
• Victor Frankl, an author Saundra admires
• “The Interview Process Got Longer in 2017”, an article from SHRM
• “How Long Does It Take to Hire? Interview Duration in 25 Countries”, a glassdoor.com study saying the average interviewing time in the US was 23.8 days